Building A Thriving Counseling Business, From Education to Entrepreneurship with Dawn-Petrice Youngs at Youngs Counseling. Ep.49

Episode Overview

• Episode Topic: Welcome to Mastering Counseling, where we engage in the intersections of Special Education and Counseling, spotlighting the transformative journey of Dawn-Petrice Youngs, LPC-S, of Youngs Counseling. We explore how her background in Special Education has enriched her counseling practice, bringing a unique perspective to therapy. The discussion illuminates the importance of a diverse educational background in shaping effective therapeutic approaches, emphasizing the integration of Special Education principles into modern counseling practices for a holistic approach to mental health.
• Lessons You’ll Learn: Listeners are in for a treat as the discussion is about the integration of Special Education strategies into therapeutic practices, learning how Dawn-Petrice Youngs utilizes her extensive background to offer a comprehensive, trauma- and neuroscience-informed approach to therapy. The episode highlights the benefits of neurofeedback therapy, showcasing its effectiveness in addressing a variety of mental health issues. Through Dawn-Petrice’s journey, you’ll discover the pivotal role that Special Education plays in developing innovative counseling techniques and the impact these methods have on enhancing client care and treatment outcomes.
• About Our Guest: Dawn-Petrice Youngs, LPC-S, is a pioneer in merging Special Education methodologies with counseling practices. With over two decades of experience first as a Special Education teacher and now as the owner of Youngs Counseling, Dawn-Petrice exemplifies how a foundation in Special Education can profoundly influence the therapeutic process. Her practice is renowned for its holistic and innovative approaches, including trauma-informed care and neurofeedback therapy. This episode provides a deep dive into her professional background, emphasizing how her Special Education expertise has been instrumental in crafting a unique and effective therapeutic model that addresses the complex needs of her clients.
• Topics Covered: This engaging conversation covers a wide range of topics, from the synergies between Special Education and counseling to the latest innovations in therapy that are shaping the future of mental health care. Discussion points include the integration of nutritional counseling and behavioral neuroscience into therapy practices, the evolution of counseling techniques informed by Special Education, and strategic advice for counseling professionals aspiring to transition from practitioners to business owners. We also delve into the challenges of establishing and growing a successful counseling practice, with Dawn-Petrice Youngs sharing her insights and strategies rooted in her Special Education and counseling experience, making this episode a must-listen for anyone interested in the dynamic field of mental health.

Episode Transcript

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: We’re using the plasticity of the brain to make new pathways to reduce those symptoms. The research has shown us there are certain patterns. We have five different brainwaves in our brains. And what we find is we have too much of one, not enough of another, or the ratios between those five are off. And when that’s happening, that’s where these mental health symptoms come from. Brain fog. Inattentiveness. Hyperactivity. Anxiety. Depression. If we can just teach the brain to work more efficiently, then these symptoms dissipate.

Becky Coplen: Welcome to Mastering Counseling, the weekly business show for counselors. I’m your host, Becky Copeland. I’ve spent 20 years working in education in the role of both teacher and school counselor. Each episode will be exploring what it takes to thrive as a counseling business owner. From interviews with successful entrepreneurial counselors to conversations with industry leaders on trends and the next generation of counseling services, to discussions with tech executives whose innovations are reshaping counseling services. If it impacts counseling, we cover it on mastering counseling. So glad to be back on Mastering Counseling again today. I am really excited to have Dawn-Patrice Youngs, who is an LPC-s and she is a seasoned therapist of over two decades who started her career in special education. So thank you for being on the show today, Dawn.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Absolutely, thank you for having me.

Becky Coplen: Let’s go ahead. I told her before that I work in a school and I work very closely with our special ed team and have so much admiration, for them. And that’s where you started. So why don’t you talk to us about your journey, uh, beginning there and then how it evolved into running a practice?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Not a problem. So I started I think I was about 23 and well, you should back that up and say when I was in college I went into originally went into a healthcare field, thought I wanted to be a nurse OT, PT, something like that. That’s always been in my blood. But my dad didn’t agree with that. He had different generations, different thoughts, and feelings on it, and he said I needed to get a business degree and that’s what he was paying for. So that’s what I did. Starts my foundation in what I do now. But. I did as my dad asked, but I also snuck in a second degree. I have a health degree as well, so went out, and did the hospital administration, hated it. I found myself teaching more at the hospital rather than managing. And so I said, well, screw it, I’m going back to school and I’m going to get my teaching certification, even though my dad didn’t want me to do that and fell in love with the special education population, particularly learning disabilities, ADHD, Emotional Disabilities, those were just those were just my kids. I loved it, I understood it, I too am ADHD. And so I became a special education teacher, did that for three years, and knew that I always wanted to go into counseling.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Having done that, because I spent the vast majority of my teaching counseling before I could teach them all of the stuff going on at home and processing that and not getting enough sleep, not getting good nutrition. So in the state of Texas, to be a school counselor at that time, I believe it has changed since. At the time, you had to be a classroom teacher for at least three years before you could be an assistant principal or a counselor. So that’s what I started working on. And then I went back and got my master’s, had my family at the same time staying home with them. Getting my master’s and then found my way back into the school system. Taught for a year and a half and then rolled into being a school counselor. I did that for eight years. Then realized that at least in my district at the time, they had put on so many administrative duties scheduling, paperwork, IEPs, all of these types of stuff that I didn’t get to meet with the kids.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: When I they would come to my door and I’d have to say I’m sorry, can you come back in an hour? I have a meeting and they’re crying, that wasn’t acceptable to me. So I said fine, I will get my LPC and I will leave and I will do my own thing. So, that’s what I did.

Becky Coplen: I love that, yeah, we have lots in common for sure. And yeah, that’s so interesting. Your dad set on the business degree and then you taking it a step further. And just I love that you would do something. You would try it, you liked it, but then you always wanted more and you kept pushing yourself into the next degree. So very cool. So, now you are the owner of Young’s Counseling in Texas. And so why don’t you tell us about your practice and how it’s if it’s a team, if it’s just you and the main things that you focus on or who you’re able to help?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: So we’ve been in practice since 2016, so almost eight years. I started off as a solo provider. It’s just me and I worked primarily with high schoolers. That was when I was a high school counselor. Those kids are my jam, primarily high school young adults got to the point where I was seeing. I hate to admit this sometimes. I was seeing 38 to 42 clients in a week. Really in four days. So if you look at an hour apiece, that’s a cramming 40-hour work week in four days. It was. I did that for like three years and finally was like, I’ve got to teach other people to do what I’m doing. Like, I’m not the end all be all I’m not. But that’s what parents thought, and that’s what my former colleagues thought. They were very excited when I went out into private practice and they would say, “You have to see DP, you have to keep it.”

Becky Coplen: A great counselor.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Yeah. So being a counselor, we’re typically old-school blue personalities. We’re caretakers. We want to help nurture. And we oftentimes do that to the detriment of ourselves and our families. I think I did a pretty good job of balancing it with my kids at three. I have three grown children now. They’re 22, 21 and 19. During this time period was right around Covid. That part was good because they were home or they had reduced schedules. So, it didn’t really bother me. But it absolutely exhausted me. And so I made the commitment. There’s a theme here. I made the commitment I needed to grow. I needed to bring in some baby counselors. And that’s not in ageism. That is, in endearing terminology, young counselors that needed to grow. So I became a supervisor and started bringing on interns and associates and started to grow my practice. Now, as of today, we have four, there’s four of us total, which seems to be a really good number. Ask me in a couple of years. I may think something differently. That’s the theme here. Every five years I get the itch. I feel like, okay, I’ve got this. I’ve got a groove. I’m efficient. I’m. I’ve learned everything I can learn. Now we got to move the bar. We gotta learn something different. That’s actually how I got into the neurofeedback component of my practice.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: So we are group practice now. We have two interns and an associate. One of my interns graduates in May and will be staying on as an associate. So it’s exciting. We see ages four and up to as old as we need. My grandmother is 101 and she likes therapy. So are there is no cap, the main areas of typical diagnoses anxiety, depression, life transitions, behavior concerns, and kids. I am not a big diagnosis and label person. I think it pigeonholes people and they think they need to be a certain way based on what the DSM says or what Pinterest or Google or whatever social media platform out there says that diagnosis is supposed to be like. So I work in symptoms and I take a holistic approach. I’m also a certified integrated medical provider, which means I’m looking at your nutrition, I’m looking at your sleep. I’m looking at your movement. We will talk about the vitamins that you’re taking. I like my clients to have blood workups before they come in. Let’s make sure our vitamin D is good, our B’s are good, our iron is good, and our thyroid is good because all of those things affect our mental health. And if that’s something easy we can fix, we don’t have to spin our wheels for six years in therapy and you get upset because you’re not making progress.

Becky Coplen: Yeah that’s I love that so many things. Just going back to the five-year itch I just couldn’t so relate. I feel like just some people are always oh you’re a fishing and things are running. And why wouldn’t we do something else or change it up? So that’s so cool that you have four people on the team and that one staying. And I’m sure the others are branching out and taking what they learn. So that’s amazing. So let’s unpack a lot of your approaches. I definitely want to talk about the medical angle. Let’s talk about that first. Tell us the charm again. You are a medical. Like are you a doctor or you use the term?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: No. no. It’s just a certification in which I go in and you are learning about the nutritional component of your diet. It adds in some body movements and postures that have been around for a very long time. I mean, you think yoga, meditation, mindfulness, it’s taking all of those components and integrating them into your life. We know if you are outside for 20 to 30 minutes and believe it’s 4 to 5 times a week, you reduce your cortisol level by 27%. Why wouldn’t we do that? You don’t see a lot of gardeners. I’m just putting it out there. They Have a gardening passion. They’re really not that angry. They’re pretty chill. And that’s because they’re outside. It’s a grounding component. It’s sharing inner with the earth not to get too low. There’s actually a lot of science behind it, but yeah, they’re these are some lifestyle changes that you can make and feel better. Why wouldn’t we do that?

Becky Coplen: That’s awesome. I love that you want people considering their health before they even come to you. And then so I assume you are often signing disclosures, possibly with their medical practitioners. Do you guys discuss that angle?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Yeah. Their release of information. I’m all about coordinating care. I want all your providers to be on the same page and helping you from all your different knowledge bases.

Becky Coplen: All right. Very cool. Let’s talk a little bit about the neuroscience-informed approach, which I’m sure is definitely part of that. But talk about how you trained or had specific classes in that and then how you brought it in with your clients.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: And so that started. Really, because we’re learning so much more about the brain and how it contributes to anxiety. And that seems to be the bulk of clients, is they have this anxiety component more so than depression, truly. And I think that goes into the American lifestyle and we’re constantly going and there is no rest, right? So that’s where it started trying to help clients with that with some cognitive behavioral therapies and dialectical behavioral therapies, that type of thing. But explaining it to clients, what’s happening when they become anxious, that flight fright freeze. We’ve now stimulated the amygdala, what the amygdala is doing, and being able to explain it to people that way. Then I ended up taking it further because I got my itch, and at the time I got my itch for more knowledge, my own son was struggling. I mentioned earlier, I’m ADHD, I happen to marry someone who’s ADHD and we happen to have three ADHD children, so our house is spinning all the time. My oldest had taken medication for his ADHD starting at five years old. Knowing what I know now, I would have gone back and done that differently. But at the time, that’s what we felt like was the best route. We did it. It worked for him until he was about 13, and he decided he didn’t like taking medication. He no longer wanted to take medication anymore. And then it just became this struggle and battle. So for the next 5, 6 years, he spiraled all over the place and began to self-medicate with cocaine and marijuana and alcohol. And if you know anything about the brain, an ADHD. He’s trying to compensate for what his brain is lacking, stimulating himself in certain areas, and depressing himself and other areas. Right? There was, as I said, no way I was going to get him to take medication, I really didn’t. It’s not my first choice at all the neurofeedback I could require him to do because he was living in my house. I went to training for that.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: I want to say. It’s 38 hours of coursework and in-person training on how to do it. Neurofeedback is where we are using operant conditioning to essentially make new neuronal pathways. Neuroplasticity. You’ve heard that term all over the place. That’s what we’re using. We’re using the plasticity of the brain to make new pathways to reduce those symptoms. The research has shown us there are certain patterns. We have five brainwaves. I know this gets techie.

Becky Coplen: It’s great. It’s great.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: We have five different brainwaves in our brain, and what we find is we have too much of one, not enough or of another, or the ratios between those five are off. And when that’s happening, that’s where these mental health symptoms come from. Brain fog, inattentiveness, hyperactivity, anxiety, depression. If we can just teach the brain to work more efficiently, then these symptoms dissipate. Wow. That’s great then. So what I’m seeing in my practice is these clients that I’ve had for six years and they would admittedly say, no, I’m a lifer. I’m a this is just me. This is what I need to do. I’ve learned it. I’ve accepted it. They’re realizing that we start doing the neurofeedback. They’re like, well, maybe I’m not. Maybe I’m not. People who say, I’ve always been anxious. I’ve always struggled with depression. That’s not normal. Let’s look under the hood. Let’s look at the brain and let’s figure out what could be going on underneath that could be causing or contributing to these symptoms. We all have life events. We all we don’t always respond well to those life events loss of a loved one, job, abusive relationship, whatever. But we shouldn’t have an overarching theme of anxiety or depression or ADHD symptoms in our lives. Let’s figure it out. Some of that’s behavioral. What we’ve learned, how we’ve learned to respond to things. But that’s still that underlying piece that shouldn’t be there.

Becky Coplen: This episode is brought to you by mastersincounseling.org. If you’re considering enrolling in a master’s level counseling program to further your career, visit mastersincounseling.org to compare school options via our search tool that allows you to sort by specific degree types, tuition, our costs, online flexibility, and more. That was such an amazing and wonderful explanation. I think that pairing it with your own personal family is huge, so thank you for being open about that. And then of course, you wanted to explore it and now you see the success within your practice. And I don’t think we’ve talked too much on here about people not staying. We talk about not staying where you’re at, obviously, but I really feel the push from you that this does not have to be a lifetime thing. So thank you for bringing that out. And that was so interesting. Let’s talk a little bit on the business side of things in that you became an LPC and now you run your practice and I think still see clients. But how was that transition for you and what are some maybe tips or advice you would give to those who are starting out in that realm?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: I would say first and foremost, you need to find others that are in the field that match your ethics. You need to share the same values and beliefs in regard to your counseling skills and practice Pick our brains, pay their consultation fee, meet with them, get their feel on it, help allow them to help you and point you in the right direction regarding legal paperwork. You need to find an attorney who understands setting up businesses, making sure that you’re setting up your business appropriately. In the state of Texas, if you are licensed by the state, you must have a professional LLC. You can’t just have an LLC. I’ve had a colleague who didn’t know any better and went on LegalZoom and just set up her LLC. Well, it’s not legal in the state of Texas.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: You have to have a professional LLC. These are little nuances that if you’re not in the field and you don’t ask the right people, you’re going to screw it up, and then you’re going to find yourself later on. It probably is not going to happen for years, maybe even decades. But something’s going to happen. It’s going to slip you up, and you’re going to lose all the stuff that all the time and effort that you’ve put into it. That’s a huge one. So find some people who are already doing it in your state who understand who are doing it the right way. Connect with an attorney who knows what they’re doing. Connect with the CPA and accountant to make sure you get that portion set up appropriately. Your attorney needs to go over all of your intake paperwork, and there are just all these little pieces that I have helped several colleagues open up their own practice.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: I have learned over the years. I used to say, “Hey, ladies, and gentlemen, you can do this. You have a master’s, you can open up your own private practice. You can run your own business. You don’t need to work for somebody else”. Having done it as long as I have, I don’t say that anymore because these are. I’ve had highly intelligent people who have crashed and burned and ended up owing tens of thousands of dollars because they didn’t do it. So, I just keep my mouth shut. If you want my help with consultation and where to go, I am more than happy to do that. But I don’t try to convince them to move over to my side. Yeah, and go practice anymore.

Becky Coplen: No, those are invaluable, tips for sure. I hesitate to even call them tips. It’s like a lifestyle thing. And I really liked what you said about lining up ethically with people who support you, because, yeah, there’s just so many facets to this world and you’re dealing with people’s toughest, deepest things. And yeah, I can see where you could end up in trouble. So that was a really good warning for us. What would you say as we look to the future in this field? And we know you’re always looking to for growth and change, what would you say are some of the changes you’re seeing? I don’t know how familiar you are with college programs and the different types of degrees you can get, but what are the trends that you’re seeing in the next few years, do you think?

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Unfortunately. I mean, I do work with a lot of interns. I’ve had interns from at least 3 to 4 different universities located all over the place. I am seeing some progressiveness there, which is exciting, but I don’t think enough. I’m really shocked that my interns are coming in and they’ve never heard of neurofeedback. We’ve got 80 years worth of research and 40 years in the last 40 years, they’ve been publishing a lot because a lot of it was practical, not theory. So they’re doing it because it’s working for people and they’re not researching and documenting. So it’s not published. But I think that my younger interns, my 20 ish late 20 interns are definitely more open to that and more open to taking a holistic approach, I think that is the area that we need to be focusing on, seeing the people as a whole person, not a diagnosis. It’s shocking to me that psychiatry seems to be the only specialty that doesn’t look at the organ that they’re actually treating. On the whole, they’re not taught to look at the brain. Figure out what’s going on there before you start carpet-bombing it with drugs. And they’ll say, I’m going to give this to you. We’ll check back in 4 to 6 weeks. When you’ve had clients who’ve actually had adverse reactions to those, had auditory hallucinations, increased thoughts of suicide, that kind of stuff, I don’t think I don’t think that is in the best interest of our clients.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: I think we need to do a little more work and look at things holistically. Like I said, I’ve had clients come in and we’ve worked and been working for a year. They’ve done great. They’re making progress. They still feel a little something. And I’m like, when did you go to your doctor last? Bring some blood work up in and their thyroid is completely low. We start working on that and they’re a totally different person. But it wasn’t caught because when they were in primary, the primary got the lab numbers back from the major lab corporations, and they’re the ones who create the ranges. What is normal and what is not? So the doctors are just looking at that paper going, well, everything’s normal, so you’re fine, but they’re not actually looking. There are four different numbers for the thyroid. They can be the ratios can be off, and they can all be normal, but they can still look abnormal when you look at them together.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: There are some doctors out there that are absolutely doing the work and going this is the problem. Why did it take 18 months to find the right doctor to recognize the situation? And it was because the counselor said, “Hey, something’s not right here.”That’s not my area. But teaching our clients to advocate for themselves. I’m not giving medical advice. That’s not my area, right? It’s not my wheelhouse. But teaching clients to go. If you feel like something is not right, let’s explore it. Let’s just keep pouring it. So I see that being more of the trend. More holistic approach. And I think some of that is a backlash of Covid and being home and beginning to question what am I putting into my body. What’s going on? There was such stuff with pharma and everything. I think people are just starting to pay attention more. At least the clients that I’m seeing are starting to question and ask, and I really don’t want to do medication. How do I do this? And I think that’s good. I think it’s putting your personal power and control back in your hands. If you want to take that medication, that’s fine. But you do the research. You figure out if that’s the best route.

Becky Coplen: Wow. This is amazing to me. I’ve actually been ill the last few weeks, and just over the last few years, I’ve come to appreciate the word of a doctor that is, practicing. I think, like growing up, we think doctors know all and always have the answer. And the older you get or you have family experience and literally they’re practicing. And I think you’re right, Covid brought out so much of that, especially long Covid. And I had a family member who struggled for months and it was literally a practice. And I love how you’re connecting that with mental health, so many great things that honestly were very personal to me too in the last few years. Thank you. And I’m glad a lot of people are seeing that in their programs and with the interns, but it’s almost like I have to think there are so many things to learn that you can’t put it in one master’s program. Right? And that’s why people are building all the time.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: I just literally last week started my PhD. It was that again, it’s applied. It’s a PhD in applied psychophysiology. So it’s where all of this kind of comes together. Your mental health and your physical functioning come together, how can bring out the best in both of them? Neurofeedback that’s subspecialty of psychophysiology. But yeah, I mean, just my personal belief. I believe the vast majority of us, not all of us. The bell curve here are outlier. We’re not talking about that. But the vast majority of us, I believe, can heal a lot that’s going on with us, if we will just pay attention to how we’re treating our body. Right. Food is medicine. What you put in your mouth is going to determine a lot of what you get out of your body. So if you’re eating a lot of processed foods, if you’re eating foods high in sugar, which most American foods are very high in sugar, you start to push down your immune system. You start to mess up your blood sugar. If you’re stressed too much now, you’re knocking down your adrenals. Well, your adrenals are your stress hormone. Now you’re kicking off too much cortisol, so you’re throwing your whole body out of homeostasis. And when you do that. Who knows what’s going to happen? So we just need to take back control and pay attention to what we’re doing.

Becky Coplen: Yes, I agree, thank you. That was enlightening in so many ways and gave us so many great facts, information and some business tips as well. So thank you so much for coming on here and giving us your time today.

Dawn-Petrice Youngs: Absolutely. Thank you. Thank you, I appreciate it.

Becky Coplen: Yes, feel free to explore Young’s counseling website, if you’re interested in the field or if you do need that type of support in Texas. To our listeners, we’re so thankful that you are tuning in. Leave us questions, and comments about what you’d like to hear more about. We’d love to hear the feedback on Instagram and Facebook, and I hope everyone has a wonderful day. Thank you so much. You’ve been listening to the Mastering Counseling podcast by mastersincounseling.org. Join us again next episode as we explore what it takes to be a business success in the counseling industry.